I Thought I'd Appreciate it Later

There’s a way many of us postpone our lives without even realizing it. We tell ourselves we’ll slow down later, appreciate it later, and be happy when things settle down. Then one day we look around and realize the years didn’t slow down while we were waiting.

In this episode, Matt and Steve talk about Father’s Day, graduation season, and the surprising realization that the moments we miss most usually aren’t the big milestones. They’re the ordinary things: rides to school, family dinners, sitting around the house, and hearing your kids call from another room.

Recovery doesn’t make life perfect, and it doesn’t stop time. But it does give us something many of us didn’t have while drinking: the chance to be there while life is happening.

Topics include:

• Why so many of us keep postponing happiness
 • The trap of “I’ll appreciate this later” thinking
 • Why ordinary moments become the memories we treasure most
 • What surprised us about how quickly life moved
 • Presence over perfection in recovery and parenting

Transcript

Matt: 0:01

I want you all to think about something. You probably at some point are thinking, I wish I had more time. I wish I was more present, which is failed logic because there is never enough time. And you can only be so present. And what you're going to you're going to have a tape recorder on those moments that are common. It's just not how it works. You haven't done anything wrong. Life doesn't slow down, but sobriety, real sobriety has given me the framework. To be present in those moments and to feel like I can make the ordinary days become memories and kids don't need perfect parents, they need present parents. Welcome to the sober friends podcast. My name is Matt J over there was Steve, and if you've wondered whether you can really get better with that alcohol, you're on the right. Whether you need to recovery, have some time sober or you're supporting someone you love, we're glad you're here. This is a podcast about sobriety emotional growth and learning how to navigate life without having to drink over it. Steve for taping this on Father's Day, it's not going to be released on Father's Day, but happy Father's

Steve: 1:14

Day to you. If you're finding some sobriety and some sobriety, if you're in recovery and if you're new in recovery, I will tell you that you can find some peace and sobriety so that and days like today that you can really enjoy them and appreciate, appreciate it was. I told, we were talking before and I said, we have a weird thing on Father's Day, right. My birthday is June 19th, and my son's birthday is June 21st, which always falls around Father's Day. So, Friday was my birthday, today is my son's birthday plus Father's Day is there. So, we did all our celebration yesterday. So, today is just a nice quiet day, I'm just my wife and I in the dog, and you can really have a nice peaceful surrounding the life if you, even if you struggle with alcohol. Well, it takes, it takes some work, but yeah, I'm really looking forward to a day. And for me, I'm a golf fan, U. S. Opens on last, last round the U. S. Opens, my wife and I will just hang out in the couch, saff the noon and eat some leftovers and wash the golf and have a beautiful day.

Matt: 2:34

That's awesome. It never occurred, I shouldn't say it never occurred to me. When I was planning this out, I wasn't thinking through that, The people who stumble upon this podcast are probably an early recovery

Steve: 2:48

right.

Matt: 2:48

or the new listeners are probably an early recovery, we're thinking about not drinking and they establish people have some sobriety. And I didn't think through that this could be a hard day if you're a dad. maybe this is

Steve: 3:00

Yeah,

Matt: 3:00

your first sober Father's Day and there's still some amends. So I kind of want to give you some hope there. And then I also want to give you the thoughts around what it's like when you've been sober some time. So, I want to give some background of why I am thinking about this and why I have a lot of emotions wrapped up. It's Father's Day Week. Last week on the 16th, my son graduated high school. They do it at Dunk and Donuts Park in Hartford probably, if not the best, the second best minor league baseball stadium and all of the minor leagues and all those kids coming in and all the work he's done and how well he has done as a student. They give you like these tassels for different achievements and the kid look like Hercules with the hat, the tassels all around his neck. My middle daughter graduated middle school. She also was cited for academics, she won the president's award for mathematics, which is especially humbling knowing she's got dyslexia. She needs a lot of help and all of that help cleared the way for her to be her best. And this happens so quickly I still look at them as little kids and my son now is 18 and he can legally sign stuff. I'm sort of kneeling him to you got you got to go online and sign up for selective service, but I can't go and do it for him,

Steve: 4:43

right?

Matt: 4:43

Because he's an adult now. And my daughter is going into high school and I saw how fast that is and she's going to be out. My son's going to be in college in the middle of August and he's going to be gone. I don't know where the time went and I think what what struck me wasn't necessarily regret was realizing thought I had more time and I don't. Now you've gone through this a lot earlier than I did because your kids are older what what was this like for you?

Steve: 5:21

It was a blurr, first of all, uhm, you know, when you're in it, it's tough, right? It's tough when you're in it. My wife and I have that conversation. I already had two kids, uhm, from a previous marriage and they're older so I remember when they started having kids she would be disappointed like her kids weren't calling her enough and talking to her and I would tell her like, honey, your kids, your kids are in that crazy part of life. Like don't, don't you remember it? And I remembered it because I was most, I was more recently removed, just removed from it where my wife, you know, her kids are my son turned 36 her oldest might, and, and her oldest just turned 50, right? Big,

Matt: 6:05

mm-hm.

Steve: 6:05

big, But I just remember when we were talking again, you know, I remember that time and some of it was, there wasn't much I could do about it. Some of it I could. I had some control over it. And this is the whole point, right? Like some people, you just have to work a lot, right? In order to make ends meet today, like you have to work a lot so that,

Matt: 6:29

yep,

Steve: 6:30

that you, you just can't make the events, but I remember like I was working a lot and I was in sales and I was recently divorced and I was playing child support so I didn't have a lot of money and I was really hustling at work. I remember my son playing sports and I, hey, I'll pick you up afterwards and then being 45 minutes late, having my son sitting out there, the only kids sitting out there

Matt: 6:51

me.

Steve: 6:51

waiting for yeah, right, just just a gut punch, right? Just

Matt: 6:55

Yeah,

Steve: 6:55

a gut punch and feeling horrible about it. But you know, and that's what I mean. Like, you know, if you could do life over, I'd be able to look at some of the stuff and do it over, but you can't, you can't. You really have to. So when I look at people who are doing, you know, stuff with their kids and they're sacrificing other things, you know, I say good for them, you know,

Matt: 7:23

them.

Steve: 7:23

good for My son was in scouts. I never got, you know, another thing I never got involved with it. I got remarried, right? We were busy. We had my kids every other weekend. I had them, you know, and it's like Thursday night with scout night for my son, but it was also one of the time a few times that my new wife and I. had time together.

Matt: 7:43

Yep,

Steve: 7:43

So it was like, do I run out and do another thing? And then on weekends, when I don't have my son that my kids like go camp in with them and be gone, like, it was difficult. So that it's a blur. My son just turned 36. He's got three kids. I had two of the grandkids over this weekend for one night, a couple days exhausting their four and three. But it's a blur. Am I sons of blur? And, you know, I mean his life is a blur now. He, you know, he took that time to have three kids. They have a one year old at home also, but without without two of the kids, he was able to do a lot. Yeah, a lot of work has a new,

Matt: 8:25

yep.

Steve: 8:26

A used play scape that he had just repainted and all, look, and he said, look what I was able to get done. Like this was important. Look what I was able to do while I didn't have two of my kids.

Matt: 8:35

And

Steve: 8:37

that's the way life is. Life is so busy, but they do a good job. They spend some time. My other, you know, my other kids and grandkids, we spend a lot of time together. It's, you know, it's a blur and when you throw and now, and this is a whole point, I wasn't, I, I wasn't drinking. I was sober. I just heard this, heard this term about the difference between being sober and having sobriety, right?

Matt: 9:07

yes,

Steve: 9:07

Being sober is removing the alcohol, like you could be sober by not drinking, but you that doesn't mean you have sobriety. I heard, I heard like a speaker online. It came across my page and I'm like, Oh, that makes sense to me because I spent years being sober where I had removed the alcohol, but not having sobriety. So a lot of this time too was me not having a program and still having a lot of my isms and still have struck and still struggling with a lot of stuff even though I wasn't drinking and then having all this stuff going on. So again, that's another thing that I want to talk to maybe some of the listeners is if you're out there and you're struggling, you know, think about, think about what your program looks like, whatever that is, whether it's AA, whether it's another program, think about whether there's some work you need to do because life is tough, man, life is tough. And I just know for this alcoholic, man, it was really hard for me to negotiate life with until until I found this a program and I found the steps and I found the fellowship. Fellowship, I found the fellowship. And, uh, it, you know, for me, listening to steps have changed my life, but the fellowship is what feeds me every day. I mean that. And when I, when I'm struggling, when I'm struggling, and I'm having some struggles mostly with interpersonal relationships or whatever they might be, it's the fellowship that I lean on. It's, it's the wisdom that the fellowship has given me it's the suggestions. It's, it's, it's the words that, that come back to me. Uh, and yeah, the program too, you know, I have to sit down, I have to reflect on things like I do that stuff too, but it's that, it's those words of advice that I've gotten. And I think, oh yeah, this is how I should handle this. Um, so it's, it's not easy, but, you know, we're here to tell you that, man, you could have some beautiful days, you have some beautiful father's days,

Matt: 11:13

birth, absolutely.

Steve: 11:14

Um, I can take my four and three year old grandkids, which is exhausting, you know, I'm 68 years old. It's not easy. It's exhausting. Um, but I want to build a, I want to leave them with a memory of me, right? So that takes work too. And if I want to have them, I want to leave my, my grandchildren with a memory of me. So I want them to come up and I want them to have time and, you know, come up to Grammy and pop his house and spend that time. So that's really, really important to me. It takes work, um, and it also takes me to be in the right place to be able to handle that. And I need, I need my program to put me in the right frame of mind to do that. So, um, that's why I'll be forever grateful for my recovery, for the fellowship, for AA in general, so that, um, I could have a weekend like I did. And then today I really do. I have a great day of Russ, which I also love.

Matt: 12:08

Those are important.

Steve: 12:09

They really, I, I, I got up this morning. I saw my neighbor right next door. He has a small dog. My dog, they played together. I saw him walking out to his pool area where he has a table with a cup of coffee. And I'm like, I'm going to go over, hang out with, with him and have coffee, start the day the dogs are playing in the yard. It's a beautiful life. It's a beautiful life. Um, and I'm, like, again, I'm for it. So

Matt: 12:35

how much do you think about, oh, God, I have this question in my head. How much do you think about your own health and the fortune that you have? Because I'm just thinking about your situation in that you have had your own very serious health issues.

Steve: 12:55

Mm

Matt: 12:56

Yeah.

Steve: 12:56

hmm.

Matt: 12:56

I'd say for you at 68, you have a remarkable level of energy and dexterity and health. You're, you're pretty good shape that you can go and do some hiking. Yeah. Things could be different, especially if you were still drinking.

Steve: 13:16

Oh, things would be different. Things would be totally different about drinking. For I, I paid no, I paid no attention to my health. When I drink, I, I got really heavy when I drink, because my eating up bad, my whole thing, right? My whole, my whole self self got out of, out of the mix. Right now, listen, I, I do feel healthy. John and I are buddy, John and I went in the hike to a mountain. Yeah, last weekend, a mad knock up in New Hampshire. Um, it's not a big hike, but it's just, it's a strong hike. One of the ways I always rate myself when I hike, and I always tell John this, we hike that mountain, and we're not fast hikers. We're slower, both. We're both 68. John will be shortly. Here's what I say, nobody, first of all, very few people are age are doing that hike. Right? You're going to see who's there. Like, there's some, but it's like, maybe, I don't think it's 10%. Um, nobody older than us or, or basically our age passed us on the way up, right? I mean, like nobody's like flying up the hill. Right? So, and that's how I look at them. Like, we're holding our own, right? Not, not only are we out there doing it, we're, we're, we're doing okay. Um, but also I'll tell you this, like, I'm starting to feel it, right? I am. I'm starting to feel it. I've just, you know, and I don't want this to be an old person. So I'm starting to feel these pains, but like, I'm starting to feel some hip pain for some reason. I mean it, like, I've never had a joint problem. And right now, I have a knee problem going on and a hip problem going on. Um, and I've never had those problems. Like I, my knees have always been good. Um, never even had a hip like, I don't like, this is so weird. What's going on? So, you know, I'm also starting to realize like, this is, you know, part of it. And part of that is like, I have abused my body. And I mean, physically, like by working hard and climbing hard. Like, so my body is going to break down a little bit. Um, but my health is so important. And, and this is the whole point, I'm to take my two young grandchildren. And I'm responsible for my wife is not capable of dealing with them. So when I have them, like there, it's me. Like,

Matt: 15:27

mm-hmm.

Steve: 15:27

It's Papa's on duty and four and three-year-olds needs constant supervision. So it's not like you just so hey go outside and play in the yard and forget about them for an hour. They require constant supervision plus they don't nap anymore so you don't even get that break. So you know because of the fact that I do take care of myself today because of the fact that I am able to stay active, I'm able to do that again spend that time with them do that kind of stuff and just like everything else because my wife doesn't know why I always do that because it is a lot of hard work in the midst of it it can be difficult but um yeah it's just so much fun to watch um to be um and I was happy when they all drove away last night get you know.

Matt: 16:18

I

Steve: 16:19

asked the kids like what your favorite part of the weekend with Papa right and they would say whatever it was and I said you know what my favorite part was that after I put you guys to bed last night I didn't hear a peep out of you

Matt: 16:31

and

Steve: 16:32

and I took a shower and I was able to go sit down and watch the world cup that's right yeah and they laugh

Matt: 16:37

and yep

Steve: 16:38

um but it's true right cause I was pretty tired um and that's all again that's all because of of my sobriety without my sobriety I don't have any of that I don't have the physical energy to do it um maybe my son doesn't even trust me enough to let me let the kids come up so many things so many things and uh but uh so it's it's it's work and just like my my sobriety is work that's why

Matt: 17:06

uh-huh

Steve: 17:06

we do this podcast is why I go to my meetings is why I take on service commitment it requires work and effort um but in the end it all pays off and and I feel great

Matt: 17:19

I took the kids to go see Harpford athletic last night and it's

Steve: 17:23

game

Matt: 17:23

the first I've ever gone they're like triple A soccer for MLS and I went specifically because it's something with the family to do but my friend who lives up in the Boston area is gonna be there his brother is a referee is a professional referee and this is probably his last wing through Harpford he's almost 40 which blew my mind because I still think of him as like I went to his college graduation or his graduation party so I still think of him as like 21-22 and I worked with him when he was a kid and I mentored him when he was like just a kid and I had wisdom to share with him and he his career has blossomed but he also does this on the side and I've seen him on like MLS games on the sideline and get to see this guy and I'm like well why is he why is he retiring he's like well because he's almost 40 and he's starting to break down and I'm like well yeah you're right I guess you can't run up and down the field like that with professional athletes after a certain age but I don't see him that way but I went because it was a chance for me to catch up my friend who lives he doesn't live close by so it's like any opportunity and my daughter who's really into soccer can can go and see him and we can do something as a family and it's pretty cheap

Steve: 18:56

yeah

Matt: 18:56

it's it's good athletic I think they were 24 dollars a ticket

Steve: 19:00

yeah

Matt: 19:00

which is not that much in a pretty nice facility

Steve: 19:05

yeah it is

Matt: 19:06

and and you get that time to be I mean there's other things I could have done but to be a way and to connect with people that is rest that type of rejuvenation is downtime but it also good time to spend because when am I gonna get this opportunity again

Steve: 19:27

I know

Matt: 19:28

don't

Steve: 19:29

yeah

Matt: 19:30

I don't know I yeah you know this is you don't get these moments back and I don't know how much my daughter is gonna continue to adore me you know I know my son loves me very much but there's a lot of times that that love is through just mumbling

Steve: 19:50

at me

Matt: 19:52

because he's 18 and it's like how do I how do we continue to connect because it's not gonna be in the same way where he giggles at my stories but it is trusting it's there but through his own way because he's older and I'm thinking through for you of like I almost have to give you the advice of those grandkids they are gonna be graduating high school soon another four and five but they're gonna graduate high school soon

Steve: 20:22

yeah

Matt: 20:23

it's gonna be it's gonna feel like tomorrow

Steve: 20:27

yeah

Matt: 20:27

yeah and then and then your relationship with them will change

Steve: 20:31

yeah

Matt: 20:31

pop I love being here in the pool and sleeping over and it's exciting and it won't be the same at a certain point yeah

Steve: 20:39

Now, but I remember listening, I had an assistant with my grandfather, matter of fact, it was pretty interesting. And I could tie this into my sobriety too. I was arrested for D. W. I. Which is what they called them back then when I was nineteen. So, in nineteen, I was not quite 20, it was 1978. My grandfather at one point had some alcohol issues, right.

Matt: 21:15

did make

Steve: 21:15

And he

Matt: 21:16

sense since this is genetic.

Steve: 21:18

Right,

Matt: 21:18

runs through families.

Steve: 21:20

And I know he was concerned, right, but it grew it grew us closer together. And at the time I was working a second shift job and my grandfather was a big fisherman and I was fisherman. And we would get together many times, and there was a pond, one town over from us, where you can rent a boat for like five bucks and we'd go out fishing. And it was only a couple years that I work, I work that short shift job for about four years, but there was a couple of years that I spent the summers doing that with my grandfather, we'd go up there, we'd rent a boat, we'd go out in the boat, and we'd do some fishing. And I'll never forget those times, right. Now, my grandfather wasn't like, you know, I mean, I have seven grandchildren total. Right. And actually four of them are our wives from the previous marriage. So consider me their grandfather, especially the two in New Jersey, my grandfather had 32. Right. So it wasn't like he could spend quality time with all 32 grandchildren. So the fact that I was able to spend that time with my with him was great. So, and I hope and that's what I hope I'm building with my kids, right. I hope I'm building that type of stuff. And I hope that as they get older, I'll be physically able to do more things that are age appropriate for them like take them to ball games and like I've been to the athletic soccer games a couple times. It's a fun. It's like a minor league baseball game. It's family.

Matt: 23:06

I will go again.

Steve: 23:07

Right. It's just a fun night out. And you can do it on a fairly cheap thing. Right. It's not like you're going to, you know, and I'll tell you this about your daughter, my daughter, your daughter will always like my daughter is a big soccer fan. We're soccer fans. So we're word cup would, you know, my

Matt: 23:26

my middle daughter is becoming one. She was

Steve: 23:29

yeah,

Matt: 23:29

streaming in the car right up to Vermont last week. She was streaming World Cup games.

Steve: 23:35

Yeah.

Matt: 23:35

I think on Disney Plus or whatever wherever they were in the car on her phone.

Steve: 23:39

Yeah, World Cup is on. I mean, all the games are being recorded in my house so I could watch them at any time. We you know, my son's saying, Hey, I'm watching the US men play on tape the lat. I want to mess anybody up. No spoilers like we tell each other, no spoilers. We're all going to watch it. Right. We, if we get together, Rocher, if if the women's team or the men's team come, they often come to is harford the play at Rensler field, which is you can't field. We almost always go with my daughter. Right. We always, it's one of the things we still do. My daughter is 33 years old. We always go to those games together. Right. And spend that time. It's really a lot of fun for us. And it's how I stay connected. And my point is, I think, I think you'll still have that, which your daughter. And I know that the relationship you had, because I know you the relationship that you've had with your son, the amount of stuff you've done with him on a one-on-one dad thing where you're taking him to volleyball tournaments, and the two of you have gone. There's no time. They don't seem like they're precious. They're busy, right. He's busy. You're busy. He's doing his thing a lot of it. But they are. You're building you're building stuff that, you know, is will last a lifetime. And you're absolutely right with these kids. Right. It's like, yeah, they get to that age of 18. You know, it's like, you're lucky to get a response from them at all. Never mind a mumble, right. A grunt. And I remember those years. I remember those years, because especially because I was divorced, so my kids didn't live with me. I mean, it came by the time the 18 by the time I kids were 16, they were coming over my house less and less, right. They were. They wasn't like, oh, stats weekend,

Matt: 25:23

mom's weekend. I'm

Steve: 25:23

it's

Matt: 25:23

sure they're coming over because they need something either a cook to me.

Steve: 25:26

Right.

Matt: 25:27

Or laundry.

Steve: 25:28

Yeah, and they just weren't coming over as much right because they had their own life they're going out their friends stuff like that so for me That switch turned earlier it seemed like that switch it turned it turned a little bit later with my son he was probably 17 And then my my daughter I could see it coming and it's like I just turned it off. I didn't force them to come over I sort of let them choose when they wanted to come over So it happens quickly, but this my relationship is great my both my kids, but they're also they're both you know they're professionals now they both work they both have good jobs daughter has no children but you know she's she's busy doing her stuff and Life life gets busy, and but it's nice like it's that we're all we're all together. Yes, we had a crazy meal

Matt: 26:20

My

Steve: 26:20

with the three young kids loud You know, just not not a peaceful meal by any means But even that I love it. I love it and my wife tries my wife a little bit nuts, but

Matt: 26:35

I could see that

Steve: 26:36

Yeah, but it's yeah, it's it's good and I I could tell that after that after a day of that I know they were all going home after that and like I said Time for me to rest and relax and and just enjoy the enjoy a good night sleep and get up today and enjoy my day

Matt: 26:55

I'm sure that that level of people energy for your wife is exhausting for

Steve: 27:00

oh yeah

Matt: 27:02

And I'm sure I can just relate Thinking from the empathy it must be the anticipation for that must make her crabby is hell I'm sure in the moment she enjoys it

Steve: 27:13

Mm-hmm.

Matt: 27:14

I'm sure it's just it's that thought ahead that things will be different People will be here. They're going to be loud. This is more energy than I'm used to or I'm comfortable with So it's almost like get her comfortable get her ramped up and then she can enjoy and then afterwards It's like leave me alone. I gotta recharge the battery

Steve: 27:35

And she does and she she takes her time goes to her bedroom close the door. Watch her tv reads Leave the kids to me this what I'm saying. It's all on me leaves. She you know show show help out show watch them if i needed to watch them But it's funny because my my grand my grand children right which are not her again, which are not biologically her

Matt: 27:55

grand

Steve: 27:56

But they love her and I tell the story my my the the middle child who just turned three And I missed him on his birthday, but so I called my son and he's a little he's a bit of a moody child at that time stubborn and I called my son and we facetime I'm like hey, I'm gonna call it was a day after his birthday. They were at another party somewhere and So I'm talking to him like hey name his grant like hey grant papa and grant would not even look at the phone for face time He would not even acknowledge that I was talking to him

Matt: 28:30

And

Steve: 28:31

then I take the face time phone And I turn it to my wife and I go, oh look there's Grammy and out of nowhere He picks up his head he looks at the phone and goes oh hi Grammy That was the only words he said and the whole right like He they love her even though right it's not her cup of tea Um, it's just such a beautiful thing especially to watch little kids do that And

Matt: 28:56

yeah, I think her talent is Especially one-to-one when she's dialed in feels like she has x-ray vision and she can see How you're feeling or what's going on without you saying it? She's very very attuned There and I think especially for kids. They pick up on

Steve: 29:15

it. Yeah now they they're good But uh like I said life's good, you know, let's sobriety You know, it's so much better to have sobriety than just to be sober You know, you can remove the alcohol like the old saying we have all these sains and we covering an AA in general You know can you can we move the alcohol, but the it is still there right Um, and the it is what we use the program and the fellowship to get rid of because

Matt: 29:43

Um,

Steve: 29:45

you know, that's that's the whole that's the whole thing for me, right? I mean I I just need I need to work on that all the time When I and I can read do you read about it is that I don't need to work on it every day 24 hours a day like I used to but every once in a while I go Oh, yeah, this is starting to this is starting to bubble up right I've pissed off a few people and that happened this past week I've pissed off a few people in the rooms, right? I've overstep my bounds a little bit Um, people are starting to push back I'm not liking it. I'm getting pissed off because people are challenging me and what do I do? I'm like And this is really what I was talking about without but I was like I always we are I always talk about Edson, I'm like If I had called up Edson and I'm like, hey, this is going on What would he tell me he would tell me Do your freaking amends Yeah, maybe they, right, no, if you would tell. Yeah, maybe they got some

Matt: 30:47

and say fre*t.

Steve: 30:48

stuff. Yeah, no, you wouldn't. Right. Do, do your amends.

Matt: 30:58

Yep.

Steve: 31:10

Him in particular for me, like I could, it took me a couple of days, but I'm standing there doing this as this is going to my head and I go, yeah, this is what I need to do. I need to call up this person. Make some amends if I hurt their feelings. Even though like there is some reason, like there's the reason why this person feeling this way and I could call this person out and though, well, what about this?

Matt: 31:32

Yep.

Steve: 31:33

But I don't need to do that today, right. I could just go, hey, listen, I'm sorry if I overstepped, I'm sorry if I made you feel left out, whatever it is. Make, make my amends. And, uh, and then, and then move on from it, right? Move on from it. And then, and I, I learned that nae, man.

Matt: 31:50

Yep.

Steve: 31:50

And it learned that anywhere else. I learned that nae, I learned that by another drunk telling me, this is how you handle those situations. And that's it, don't make it more complicated. Don't try to fix anything else. Just do your part. And, and I know from experience, when I do that type of work, I feel better. Right. And that gives me the sobriety that I'm looking for as opposed to just being sober because I'm not any so. And, uh, so it's a, it's a beautiful, it's a beautiful thing.

Matt: 32:23

Having steps like that, having that amends process is so beautiful. I think about it all the time that thing that motivates me to do an amends is, all right, I get to go to my recovery toolbox and do something recovery related. And I have that opportunity to do something to deepen a relationship with somebody else because I'm saying, sorry.

Steve: 32:47

Right.

Matt: 32:48

And, and that is the motivator and knowing, I have the release valve. I've done something. I have a way of approaching it. I want you all to think about something. You probably at some point are thinking, I wish I had more time. I wish I was more present, which is failed logic because there is never enough time. And you can only be so present. And what you're going to, you're going to have a tape recorder on those moments that are common. It's just not how it works. You haven't done anything wrong. Life doesn't slow down, but sobriety, it, real sobriety has given me the framework to be present in those moments. And it's a feel like I can make the ordinary days, become memories and kids don't need perfect parents. They need present parents. All right. I'd love to hear what you have to say. Matt, it's sober friends pod calm. And if you like this episode, can you share it with somebody and give us a five star review on Apple podcasts, the thumbs up on Spotify. And make sure you press all the buttons everywhere. If there is a follow button, do it. Do me a favor. I'd love it. Steve, thank you for sharing your vulnerability today.

Steve: 34:11

You're welcome at

Matt: 34:12

we'll see everybody next week. Bye, everybody.